Promoted to the front page
I am so sick and tired of being female and Muslim. I swear to God I cannot take it anymore. The things that grind me down are all inside the community. Do you know I was in a discussion online about funky hijabs today - I don't veil, but I wear scarves for privacy and, well, because I currently have a shaved head - like "what's the funkiest hijab you have?" I'll even link it: Hijab: What Kind Of Scarves Do You Favour?, Umm... colours, styles, ethnic origin.... I collect funky cloth pieces from around the world and use them in unexpected ways, like the giant, perfectly cylindrical turban I make out of a kuffiyyah.
Anyway, here in the Sister's page of a website, I naturally get trolled. By a man. Who cuts and pastes. IS THERE ANY MORE EVIL THING IN THE WORLD THAN CUT'N'PASTE LECTURES ON A MUSLIM FORUM BOARD? ASTIFIRAGHULLAAH! HARAAM HARAAM!
I can't bear to repeat the hatefulness here (the phrase "a woman who leaves the home without her husband's permission is destined for the hellfire" appears in it...). Just go to the link. It's like four times longer than the entire damn thread.
I just... I can't frigging take it anymore. Why is Islam such a damned slog all the time? Sometimes, to paraphrase a comedian I know and love, "a bitch just wanna pray." You know what I mean?
Ye gods, just get up off my back, you mouthbreathing eejits.
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Dollface, it's not Islam that's cramping your style- it's friggin' trolls. Friggin' trolls are equal opportunity annoyers. And I will hunt down cool hijab fabric options especially for you. *mwah*
You aren't alone. That really is the bottom line. This is so rampant in Islam that it empties out Masjids and women are barely on speaking terms half the time. Look, sister, you are different, you are an exclamation point in a religion full of periods. These women "choose" to become blank pages. If you wear lipstick, or if you wear perfume, or if you talk to men, if you do this, that, the other you get gossiped about, lied about etc. One sister I know who stays home now from the masjid and does not socialize at all with Muslimahs because of this, did venture out during Ramadan only to be "sort of singled out" by the Masjid watchdog and told, "you can't wear nail polish" which she does, "you can't wear perfume' which she does, and you should not be walking so close to the men exiting the masjid blah blah blah.....oh and when you pray, your arms should not be on the floor.....okay. Muslims don't get it they won't get it. Christians get this piece. You dont keep people in the religion by flogging them constantly and hurting and degrading them.
Jews get this piece as well. They divided themselves into Orthodox ( for those who stick to the letter of the law) such as the Muslims we discuss here, and those (Reform) who don't. I fall way to the left of the basic Muslimah in terms of some things, but not all. I wear make up. But I also traditionally hijab. Muslim women don't know what vanity and modesty mean for the most part. They think if you wear color ful attractive clothes and some make-up, I am not talking about flaming red lips and one inch eyelashes. That you are vain. Vanity means that you worship yourself over Allah. That all your time, energy and money is spent on yourself. Putting on a bit of lipstick, or as in your case being arsty with your hijab and your head doesn't put you outside the realm of modest. Okay? So rest easy you aren't alone.
I wonder who is more modest, a woman with a shiny, sparkly scarf who thinks she is so pious yet makes herself "beautiful", or me, who eschews that woman's extreme views of hijab ("everything but this (face) and this (hands)") - in fact, doens't veil at all - yet has a clean-shaven head.
Which of us holds more closely to modesty, I wonder? I know what the Wahhabis would say...
The Wahhabis would have none of either of us I am sure of it.
Well, I didn't mean the shiny, sparkly hijab girl was you, but rather the neo-fundies of the Sunni and Shi'ah (the so-called "moderates").
It is totally true that neither of us would be even vaguely acceptable, however. I do better with the Twelver fundies because honestly they are like Catholics are to the Protestants: ascribing divinely guided power to their religious hierarchy (marja3) yet therefore less individually Puritanical (i.e. judgmental of *others*).
I find Twelver theology and taqliid unacceptable but I find Shi'ah piety and bhakti-like adoration for the pious and holy eminently fabulous. Right now so much Sunnism is like Judaism with all the rules and none of the joy and love - Judaism's rules, extremist Christian obsession with Hellfire and how evil everything that brings happiness into the world is. One of the things I always loved about Judaism was its constant reminder that the most important commandment was to protect life and that the Law could be summed up while standing on one leg: "Do not do to others what you would not want done to you."
It's not just Islam. I am a moderate-to-progressive Anglican who gets trolled all the time for suggesting that non-Christians may have a relationship with God, that homosexuals aren't evil and that women make good leaders. If people like us are destined for hell, then at least the company will be interesting!
I find that I often have more in common with those of different faiths but who take a similar approach to faith than my more conservative siblings in faith. And I'm not sure it would be heaven if the more annoying trolls were around haranguing everyone. Perhaps there's a VIP- very irritating pest- section in Heaven especially for those who haven't really done anything worse than be a pain to one's fellow humans.
And daughter of Islam: to assume that you know God's will well enough to press it on others takes a great deal of something. Exactly what that would be besides years of rigorous study or direct revelation, I'm loath to suggest.
P.S. Cypress looks quite fetching with a shaved head, so perhaps that should factor into the modesty issue.
Assalaamu alaykum Cypress
i must say, your response to 'undercover brother' was really funny - i would never have guessed that he made you angry. you definitely handled his comment well.
however, call me whatever you like, i do agree that hijab does have strict guidleines and compliance with such guidleines is compulsory. that said, i have a number of good friends who don't wear hijab and even some who wear it on/ off. i wear full hijab (minus the face-veil) and i try my best to advise the muslims around me, just as i expect them to advise me. i do not do this because i think i am more pious than my unveiled sister. i only do this because in this issue of hijab alone, my knowledge of islam (as minimal as it is) informs me that actually, hijab is better for a woman than no hijab - my reasoning simply being: that is what it says in the quran and that is what the blessed Messenger has said. you may disagree, and that's completely your decision.
but, as muslims it is an obligation for us to advise each other. likewise as muslims it is forbidden to make superficial judgements about each other.
and this is where, i think, the major issue is. advice is one thing but judging is quite another.
for example:
are you more pious than a sister who wears the hijab? only Allah knows that.
would you be more pious if you stayed the same (spiritually/ practically etc) and adopted the hijab? according to what islam says, then yes.
in essence we should compare our present selves to our potential selves and when advising others we ought to have this in mind (as well as common courtesy and good manners)
wassalaam
Covering your hair is not obligatory and it is not mentioned in the Qur'an. What is mentioned is covering your breasts. Since women in the time of Mohamed wore head scarves, the mention in the Qur'an is to use your head-scarf to cover your breasts. From my English translation of the Qur'an 24:30: "And tell believing women to lower their gaze and be modest, and to display of their adornment only that which is apparent, and to draw their veils over their bosoms and not to reveal their adornment save to their own husbands or..."
Is the veil mentioned anywhere else in the Qur'an? Please educate me!
The passage before this one, 24:29 reads: "Tell the believing men to lower their gaze and be modest. This is purer for them. Lo! Allah is Aware of what they do."
My question is this, why isn't more time spent on male behavior? It is in my husband's family where his purity before marriage was as important as his sisters; but I don't see this when I look around at the typical Muslim brother.
If it was so all-important (as given by the amount of our time and attention devoted to it) for women to cover their hair, wouldn't it have been stated more explicitly in the Qur'an? We are talking about God's word revealed to us by Mohamed. God is All-Powerful! If this were an obligatory commandment and not simply a custom then God would have made this explicitly clear in the years during which the Qur'an was revealled to Mohamed.
I applaud my sisters for choosing to wear the hijab when it is truly their choice and when it brings them closer to God. I work very hard to be a good person (often failing miserably), but a piece of cloth on my head doesn't make or break it for me, it is my own internal weaknesses. If I wear the hijab and then back-bite or gossip about my sisters in faith, am I reflecting what it means to be a good Muslim?
i totally agree with what u have said. islam doesnt make it obligatory to wear hijabs.
totally agree that MORE TIME SHOULD BE SPENT ON MALE BEHAVIOR
there are so many times that whenever a quarrel occurs, its the female always at the receiving end of fatwas. women are asked to correct themselves. why cant we ask the bludy males to correct their behavior first.
why are we muslims making islam so rigid in nature. changes are meant to be made in our outlook and perception. and there is no where written in islam that changes arent accepted
EXAMPLE.... people earlier used to give AZAN for the prayers (namaz) in a close vicinity where all can hear it but nowadays when times have changed we are using loudspeakers in mosques for the AZANS ..........
we should not be so rigid that we restrict our way of living too
Assalaamu alaykum Fashion Mujiahid
something tells me you don't like me. fine. but please, in future, do try to read my response for what it is. maybe i was ambiguous. if so then let me clarify what i meant and insh'Allah clear the bad feeling.
1) my comment to sister cypress was not intended to be some arrogant display of knowledge. like i said previously: i don't have much.
but the few things that i do know i try to make sure they are based on authentic knowledge (ie quran and sunnah. these are the two sources that all muslims subscribe to by the way - not just me). More importantly, if i do try and convey my knowledge to others i make sure for certain that it is in fact correct and i do this by.... studying (unfortunately, direct revelation is reserved only for the best of mankind, and i am far away from that...unless you thought otherwise)
2) Allah has not revealed His entire will, but He has revealed part of it, and He (according to what we know from the Quran and from what the Messenger has said), expects us to try and understand what He wants and to implement it in our lives. if this was not the case there would have been no need for revelation and no need for the Messengers.
3) all that i was trying to highlight before was that regardless of whether one wears the headscarf/jilbab/niqab or whatever your conception of the word 'hijab' is, we should strive to better ourselves via whatever channels we can find. if that means learning arabic, in order to understad the quran in its fullest sense, go for it. if that means looking after your neighbours pets while they're on holiday, what's stopping you? if that means wearing the hijab, may Allah make it easy for you.
the Messenger, may Allah bestow peace upon him, knew his ummah was weak. he knew that we would need one another to become closer to Allah. that's why he said it is an obligation for us to teach others what we know about this religion and support each other in practicing it
Sister Cypress, if you or anyone else took my response negatively then please forgive me for making you feel in such a way. i did not intend to cause offense.
Fi amanillah
Wa alaikum salaam daughter of Islam:
If you'd like to have your comments taken at face value, it would do to extend that courtesy to others, and to recognize it when it does happen.
Interpreting Islamic source texts and deciding which positive commands may apply is well above the pay grade of most of the folk on this site.
I wasn't offended by D. of Islam, but I do find that the more I learn about Islam, the more complicated even apparently "simple" issues like hijab become increasingly complex.
to the contrary sisters Cypress and Fashion mujahid
quite often issues can be simply understood by verifying the claims of others with the quran and sunnah (by sunnah i mean not just the Messenger's words, but his actions and also his approval of the actions of the righteous companions).
even scholars. whether you appreciate their input or not, they will utilise every bit of 'source text' available to them in order to derive an opinion and support it. this is why at least in sunni islam we acknowledge all four schools of thought as equally valid - allowing for legitimate differences of opinion, and yes, even debate.
interpreting source text... : )!!! i am certainly not qulified for that - but there is nothing stopping any of us to reach that level. it will take years and we may die in the process of getting there. but Allah wants us to know Him. He wants us to know His will. He wants all of us to succeed. so we should verify our own views and expect them to be wrong when confronted by the words of Allah and his blessed Messenger. We should extend our boundaries, be ready to shed some of our views (as difficult as that may be) in order to conform to Islam. and we should support and help one another in achieving Jannah.
Wassalaamu alaykum wa rahmatullahi wa barakatu xxx
"quite often issues can be simply understood by verifying the claims of others with the quran and sunnah (by sunnah i mean not just the Messenger's words, but his actions and also his approval of the actions of the righteous companions)."
Yes, but when I read the Qur'an, and it does NOT agree with what it is alleged to say? Then what? Not so nearly as clear, not so nearly.
"Yes, but when I read the Qur'an, and it does NOT agree with what it is alleged to say? Then what? Not so nearly as clear, not so nearly."
But that's the best part of reading the Qur'an: it's so rich with meaning, that alternate perspectives and nuances are always around the next corner. Other opinions should be heard and examined, but are only perspectives, single facets of a brilliant jewel. And who would want to spend their life looking at only one facet of a matchless ruby?
"Yes, but when I read the Qur'an, and it does NOT agree with what it is alleged to say? Then what? Not so nearly as clear, not so nearly."
true - you would find yourself in a dilemma.
but then, you need to solve it for yourself...
for myself, and right now i speak for myself only - i try to set out a clear purpose and have a clear goal in sight - i want to be closer to Allah. and i can only achieve this by doing as the blessed Messenger had advised. the only way i can know what the Messenger advised us to do, i have to - whether i like it or not - look at whatever source of knowledge i have access to... unfortunately as you pointed out previously, there are multiple views . but again i can only assess the strengths and weaknesses of each view by looking at which uses the strongest evidence... and then i make a decision, reminding myself that i only make this decision because i feel it is what Allah wants for me - sometimes it may conform to my initial views. and other times it may not. but my goal was and always is to become closer to Allah and accept His will.
i remeber when i was first confronted with the report that the Messenger himself had actually stoned a woman to death... i didn't want it to be true. i refused to acknowledge the report and i kept searching for alternative views - until i found out that yes he stoned the woman to death BUT he did this with compassion and pity for the woman. he advised her not to tell him that she committed adultery and tried to convince her that she was in fact mistaken. but she was adamant that she be puished so that she could be forgiven for her sin. after stoning her and when her soul left her body, the Messenger offered supplication for her and - perhaps the most beautiful part of the story - the blessed Messenger had announced the status of her repentece. at the end of my search for an answer i found that i loved the Propht even more than i had done when i refused to acknowledge the report in question...
i didn't say the process was easy. i just said that with Allah's help it doesn't have to be as difficult as you might first think it to be
fi amanillah
i remeber when i was first confronted with the report that the Messenger himself had actually stoned a woman to death... i didn't want it to be true. i refused to acknowledge the report and i kept searching for alternative views - until i found out that yes he stoned the woman to death BUT he did this with compassion and pity for the woman. he advised her not to tell him that she committed adultery and tried to convince her that she was in fact mistaken. but she was adamant that she be puished so that she could be forgiven for her sin. after stoning her and when her soul left her body, the Messenger offered supplication for her and - perhaps the most beautiful part of the story - the blessed Messenger had announced the status of her repentece. at the end of my search for an answer i found that i loved the Propht even more than i had done when i refused to acknowledge the report in question...
_____________________________________________________________________
The Blessed messenger did not stone a woman to death.
The story goes.....
She came to him after committing adultery and said stone me, I have committed adultery and I am pregnant. The Messenger said, I cannot, you are pregnant. Go...
She comes back to him after delivering the baby and says I am ready..
He tells her, I cannot, the baby needs you come back when the baby has been weaned.
She comes back and says the baby has been weaned...
The Messenger tells her to go because Allah has forgiven her.
If you read this carefully this story is about a woman who is swimming in guilt about being raped. There is no man in this equation or witnesses. So its about rape. She gets pregnant as a consequence and her guilt has made her less than sane, so the prophet (pbuh) knows this and keeps sending her away, first for 9 months and then for
another year, and never in any of this time did anyone step forward and say I saw her, I know the man etc etc. It doesn't say "a married woman" either.
re: stoning and the Messenger
lailah23 assalaamu alaykum wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuh
the blessed Messeenger DID stone the woman to death. it is recorded in sahih muslim (refer to the story of the woman from ghamid and also the slave girl of juhaina)... yes the Messenger (sallaahu alaihi wa sallam) refuses to stone the woman from ghamid, asks her to wait and give birth, then tells her to wean the baby and then says he does not want to leave the child without a carer. at which point one of the companions offers to look after the child and then the woman is stoned to death.
as for the rape issue. the woman who was actually stoned to death said that she committed adultery... we cannot say otherwise if that is the assertion that she herself had made.
you said...
'and never in any of this time did anyone step forward and say I saw her, I know the man etc etc'
four witnesses of the act of zina is not the only way a person can be convicted of the crime.
first, lets be clear about the four witnesses...they must be of upright character and must all have seen the actual penetration of the male sexual organ into the female sexual organ. it is not enough that the four witnesses see two naked people together.
the second way is if the person who committed adultery confesses three times without coercion from anyone (as is clear with the story in question) the judge must discourage the person from confessing, just as the beloved Messenger (sallaahu alaihi wa sallam) had done so.
in any case muslims are always discouraged from exposing their sins and exposing the sins of others. the best thing to do in either scenario, whether adulterer or witness is to seek repentence from Allah.
forgive me if i have made a mistake in any of my accounts, but this is what i know according to the evidences. if you know of any sound evidence to the contrary, please do share it with me as i can always benefit from others.
jazzakallah khayr
fi amanillah
ASAK
I think the word adultery is used for women during biblical times because it was a harsher thing to have done than fornication. But rape was another issue. I still think that it was a case of rape the woman acts irrational, she is suicidal. Begging someone to kill you? I the Quran and all Holy books and Hadith have to stand up under some very strong scrutiny. I don't see in this Hadith a woman who is in her right mind and the messenger Ipbuh) acted with great compassion, which is what we are supposed to get from this. You see if there had been a true adulterey worthy of stoning someoen would have come to the messenger, "we caught her________" And then the natural progression. But no, what we see is this flaky guilty woman running around no doubt to not only the messenger(pbuh) but likely just around to any man asking to be put to death.
Maybe she simply mentally ill, and pregnant. Compassion is what the lesson is here.
as for the rape issue. the woman who was actually stoned to death said that she committed adultery... we cannot say otherwise if that is the assertion that she herself had made.
The Messenger, based upon my reading of Hadith would not have stoned a woman. The Hadith are there for us to learn his heart, his mind, and ways, and I believe he was a man so compassionate that he would not have stoned a woman based on her word alone.
Stoning
There is a website where you can search the hadiths and Qur'an:
http://islam.about.com/gi/dynamic/offsite.htm?zi=1/XJ/Ya&sdn=islam&cdn=r...
When I put in 'stoning' as the search word I found the incident of the pregnant woman who claimed to be pregnant by adultery and also a separate incident of a man who claimed to have committed adultery. Both were stoned by their own request.
These stories are extremely difficult to read. I am a recent convert to Islam and I was formerly a Christian brought up on Jesus' message "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone".
These two stories about Mohamed are making me very uneasy and they don't fit with my understanding of God. I have to think that these two people were riddled with guilt. I don't know what else to say.
Dude don't blame Islam, blame Khomeni and this damn wave of Mullahism.
These progressives are just as bad too.
None of these Islamic Organizations even care about promoting education among our youth.
http://www.foxbusiness.com/story/markets/industries/media/picking-colleg...
Everything mentioned in the article has been what I have been trying to get Islamic Organizations to promote for the past 6 months (some periods at greater intensity than others) but none of them care.
The promotion of acquisition of skills in our community takes a backseat to Barak Obama's Mahdi style ascendency to the presidency, I kid you not at a CAIR/MSA banquet at UC Berkeley some third rate Mullah (all Mullahs are third rate) from the Zatuna institute peddle that crap and promoted a sense of fear and victimization among the naive children who attended.
These Islamic Organizations are just as corrupt as our governments back home, they play on the politics of fear it is sick.